Re: Abusive behaviour on this forum must not be tolerated

[HeelerLady]

Milo,

I echo your sentiments. Due to one person's nastiness, the whole dynamic of the board has changed and I fear we've lost some wonderful people. I also find myself not being on as much either. Granted we can still have some interesting conversations - still love the quiz that Charlotte posted last week. And we can have discussions...most of us are respectful of differences (Richard and I are polar opposites politically but we can have an intelligent discussion without resorting to nastiness).

I also wonder about having several moderators. I know this is Rhonda's place and I would respect her decisions. I do wonder if managing this forum and working a full time job plus dealing with the dreaded M is overwhelming some times. I would say multiple so that there are no "moderator's pets". Just a suggestion and observations.

Becky

[pen]

Not sure of the technical logistics Becky, but we could suggest to Ronda that any of us that are willing, and you do have to be of course......perhaps go on a list and maybe do a month at a time, or whatever fits.,
maybe we even need one for the Americas and one for UK/Europe to cover the time zones.
I am up when you are asleep etc.

Perhaps it is worth having a sensible friendly discussion about.

P

[AuntieBubbs]

Well, I for one am worried about what Becky refers to: "moderators' pets." I know I would have to step back from the board if I saw that happening, and if some people, who shall be nameless, were made moderators, I can definitely see that happening. I think some people would make excellent moderators, and others, less so.

I've been a moderator myself (RPG board, yes I'm a geek ), and I wouldn't want the job. Too much work.

I also wouldn't want Ronda to think we've lost faith in her. I happen to think the system works fine as it currently is. Every time I've PM'd Ronda about a problem, it's been taken care of within 24 hours. Often within 2 hours. Are we sure the system doesn't still work now, or are we assuming Ronda can't handle it just because we don't like certain people's posts? Yes, they are inflammatory and annoying and flaming and trollish - but do they actually cross a line? Enough that Ronda should delete them and/or ban the person/people making them?
Step back and take an impartial look. Be sure. Ronda may still be performing her moderator duties - just because she isn't deleting said posts doesn't mean she isn't aware of them. She has to be fair and she has to be impartial. We may not like those posts, but Ronda's job isn't to just do what the majority of the board would like, it's to do what is right and fair for the entire board.

Understand I don't agree with what's been going on, and I don't support flame wars or the type of belligerance and hostility I've been seeing lately. I think it's pathetic and sad, and I've blocked the people who are creating this atmosphere so that I don't have to be bothered with their posts. But, while was still reading their posts, I didn't see anything that actually crossed the line that, say Ali did - and got him banned. So I don't see that this other person deserves to be banned. So I think Ronda IS doing her job as a moderator. I think giving moderator power to other people should be dealt with very, very carefully. There are two or three people here that I think would handle it responsibly and impartially. Sorry if that hurts anyone's feelings, but I actually leave myself out of that 2 or 3 people too, you know.

Has anyone PM'd Ronda about the Oxycontin threads, to take them down? I'm more concerned about those being up than about the inflammatory posts of "he/she who shall be nameless"
Those should come off the board. Apart from being illegal, if they have a virus in them, they could ruin someone's computer.

Ok, I'll get off my soapbox for the day.

[Almostangela]

I'm on board with AuntiBubbs here.

I'm a big advocate of keeping things simple, freedom of speech and all voices welcome. I think the fluidity of this forum and the way that Rhonda has set it up is what makes it so beautiful. For brainstorming of ideas to be effective, it has to come from all angles and it is only through the collaboration of the diversity of people and experiences that we can learn new things. If you try to control things into socially safe packages, you begin a sensor process that potentially excludes valuable resources.

Also, a person that bothers you, may not necessarily bother me, or another person. My personal interactions in life may be such that I am less reactive to what you would see as offensive or annoy you. Rhonda doesn't interact daily so she has no emotional context to which she would be judgemental. She has always proven to be impartial. Whereas, I highly doubt that I, or other daily participants would be so strong as to be impartial in their decisions.

There is a wonderful tool on this site whereby you can block a person, so if you feel you are being targeted, bullied, or annoyed by a person, then please use it. The best way to stop an argument is to say nothing and move on.

[HeelerLady]

Bubbs,

I'm on facebook and I've seen the moderators have to get involved and take care of things. The only reason why I thought several was so that it wouldn't fall to just one person and this would only be if Rhonda herself desired the help. Personally I think she does a bang up job of things but as you mentioned being a moderator is a lot of work. We seem to have a trouble maker from time to time and she's done well dealing with them as far as I'm concerned. There is one that is still a bit concerning but who knows what's been said to them in private and perhaps they've been warned.

The block function is a massive stress reliever I have to say and I think we maybe should have a note on how to do this. That way when we get spammers, we can point to an instant way to not see their posts until Rhonda is able to delete their posts. It would have been helpful to know how to do that a while ago. And for new users.

Also I think the oxycontin posts are gone...I think. I haven't seen them for a while anyway.

Becky

[Paradox]

I think the forum works fine, as is, with a few hiccups here and there. It's going to happen, human nature...

For the most part we are able to self moderate and when we can't Ronda has always stepped in. Whenever I have addressed a concern to Ronda she has answered promptly and wisely.

I do not feel we need an additional level of governance. This forum has been running just fine for many years. I always have a fear of "too many cooks"...

[pen]

Ok, as I suggested it, then I will withdraw that suggestion. I have made a report and nothing whatsoever has happened and then I learned that Ronda was a bit, ah....busy and thought it might be nice to lighten her load for her for a while....temporarily.
I certainly haven't lost faith in her. She has always done a great job....but we can all get a big bogged down sometimes.
It is still her forum and she would still be in "charge". Was suggesting help, not a take over....I respect Ronda and the forum.
But as it seems to be a bad idea, then forget it please.

Sadly Angela, blocking is not the answer...as a few others have commented. It helps, but its not restoring the board to how it was. Even without seeing the posts, you still get the gist of what is going on by the comments of others, and, yes, say nothing, but it isn't fun to make a comment and be pounced on. Hopefully it will improve in time. But we have lost a few people I hear, and I don't think that is right. I hope they give us another chance.

Anyway I'm out. Just a suggestion, but apparently not a good one..

[CluelessKitty]

I first read Leslie's post about problem on the forum where I suggested adding moderators for petty stuff like removing "Oxy.." or controversy causing posts.

I still think it is needed, to have on or two persons to help Ronda to keep peace and order since she really doesn't have to remove such a petty post like the "oxy" herself.
And she was already tired many times with having this forum, so I am worried that someday she will have enough.

But I can not stress enough - removing one's post and leaving the other is require great judging skills. It's not easy.

Risa

[pen]

It does require good judging skills Risa.....absolutely.
And I suppose the best way to avoid trivial responses to posts is to have two moderators to make decisions.
That is what we did on the CFS forum. No big decisions like post removal was made by one person.

And yes I was concerned for Ronda. N one wants to usurp her at all. Least of all me.
But....I only thought the idea might be put to her, she can veto of course.

P

[AuntieBubbs]

No one's saying you, or whomever wants to, isn't welcome to put this, or any other, idea to Ronda if you want, whenever you want. My opinion is it isn't needed. Some people seem to agree with me, some people don't. But no one is saying don't do whatever you want, or make whatever suggestion you want. Freedom of speech, freedom of action. That's the beauty of the board.

[Ivy]

Richard,
lesson learned.
Actually I learned this lesson through the years and I normally do not overreact in this way. I played her game and I only harmed myself and the serenity of this board.

Pen, thank you so much for helping me to explain my position. Sometimes I have language limits, in particular when I need to explain detailed things. I know that a wrong word can make a huge difference. I tend not to use a vocabulary to write in English and I think that in some occasions I miss that particular phrasal verb or idiomatic expression that would make my words sound different.

About moderation I think that - after all - we already have some members who unofficially are helping us to self-moderate. Also, it seems that any of us is ready to help others when things need to be cooled down. In turn, we keep the peace and the good atmosphere.

I also think that a forum misses two important parts of a dialogue: the voice tone and the body language. This lack often worsens what one is trying to say.
For instance, my strong reply to Senna would have never been shouted loud with anger or aggressive voice. I re-read my bad post and - actually - my mind tended to interpreter it as told by a harsh, crazy, frustrated, nasty old witch . Which is not exactly my style when I talk in person...
Some people here have often been misunderstood because they just wanted to be ironical but the words without voice and facial expressions can often been misinterpreted (is this last word correct English or just a bad translation from my own language?)

I am sure than even some of Senna's post would sound different if she only could tell them in person.

Emoticons help us a bit to relax and give some "live" shape to a sentence, but sometimes they're not enough.

I will personal try to add also comments on the tone of delicate posts I will make due to my limited language.
I wish I could write like Pen, Richard or Angela. They are PERFECT at passing also emotions and tones only through words....

Have a nice day

[pen]

Ivy, You are fine, really.
Your posts are articulate and interesting.
You English is great. I get a lot wrong, and it was my best subject, and of course it's my first (actually my only) language.
As for perfect writing...thanks, but I seem to slip up quite a bit myself...

I agree and have pointed out previously. The written word is so easily misconstrued.
Without the inflection verbally, and of course the body language face to face.
You are right, few of us would react in the way we might sometimes do here.
I try to keep calm, I know it does not serve me to get angry.
Instead I am afraid, I get hurt. Sometimes my cup doth runneth over.
Sometimes I want to see that person, to be with that person, so that I can suss where they are really coming from.
But would I shout and scream at them....

I mentioned on another post that I was a mod on a forum for CFS.
That 3 people wrecked the forum. It begun with one person, who behaved in a similar way to that which we have been experiencing here. After the whole thing had gone down, and despite trying to get a hold of her to find out if we could calm it;
we discovered that she was of a certain religious persuasion, and had been abused. Spoke volumes about her attitude, and aggression. She was so judgemental and angry...But she never gave us a clue.

Why do I impart this bit of history? Because we all have back stories, we all have frailties and some are more open than others.
Me I am pretty much an open book...what do you want to know? But this is not the same for all, and as forums such as these are so anonymous, we can, if we wish decide to be someone quite different to our authentic self.

So I agree Ivy. With only the written word to go on, without real knowledge of a person's back story, or even current situation, except what they chose to share. AND,.....given we are all struggling with this dreadful illness, I am sure these things will happen from time to time. And we will promise to be tolerant, and non judgemental. But every now and then. Bad day/situation. We will snap. What is nice, is that, we can come back when we feel a bit better, and although we can not take back the words, we can explain and apologise if we so desire.

To my mind Ivy, you didnt need to. But it is gracious of you that you did.
You're fine Ivy

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